New Centaur Minor owner

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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Odysseyss on Fri May 08, 2015 11:38 pm

After reading the article, it really does not give me much info, except to pry off the crossover. Sure, take a look at it once you take out speaker switch box, the one in back with 6 srews, then ask yourself how is it getting thru such a small opening. What do have to do break it. It's at least 7 inches wide and longer than that. Looks like I'll have to settle for some new binding posts and bypass the switch. My EE friend will be here next week, to do the easy mod. He will take another look at it and give me his opinion. Don't want this to be a major project. The next thing I would want him to do is replace the woofers. They are still working fine but over 20 years old. Anyone know what to buy? I know Viva or whatever is gone. I don't mind if they cost a lot just want ones that fit and will sound good. Thanks for any info on this doable project.
Later
Ken
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Odysseyss on Thu May 14, 2015 11:39 pm

Hello everyone. Finally got the Apogee Minors done. No crossover change but my EE friend eliminated five physically unsoldered connections in each speaker and replaced with five silver soldered direct connections. Also replaced binding posts with Cardas solid copper binding posts. He took some pics inside from binding post hole, and emailed them to me. If anyone wants to take a look at crossover from this angle can email me and I will forward pics. Maybe someone here knows how to post them, my e mail is ryriken66@att.net. The switch is also soldered and in normal position only. Sound is not night and day, but I do hear a cleaner sound, and bass is tight. Thanks for all your help and comments, especially to Van. I'll leave the speakers well enough alone for now per Graz.
Regards
Ken
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Gordz on Thu May 21, 2015 11:16 pm

With help from "Van" I have attached two pictures of Ken's Minor Crossovers at Ken's request.

Cheers

Gordz

http://tinypic.com/r/2qte446/8

http://tinypic.com/r/ok0mxl/8
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Odysseyss on Fri May 22, 2015 12:13 am

Thanks for dong this. Van now you can see how hard it would be to work on. Not like yours....
Regards
Ken
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby EldRick on Fri May 22, 2015 4:14 pm

Van's idea of adding small bypass caps with alligator clips should be easy, and even drizzling some epoxy onto the coils while in place shouldn't be difficult (use the kind with a 3" nozzle that mixes the epoxy).

These two things would be a significant upgrade.
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Odysseyss on Sat May 23, 2015 6:28 pm

EldRick talked to my EE friend. Said we would have to solder bypass caps, just clipping them on may come off when putting back cotton batting. As for coils how much of a difference? He said they are already in pretty good , and what do you do just make sure both coils are covered. Thanks for any info.
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Vansloneker on Mon May 25, 2015 9:29 am

By looking at the pics I have to agree these crossover are a very solid fit.

With what I know now, personally I would do anything to disable them and have a better external crossover.
poor guy
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Odysseyss on Mon May 25, 2015 4:34 pm

Thanks Van,
I told you it wouold be impossible to do . As for external crossover my EE friend never said anything about that. The best he could follow now is bypass some caps but they can't be clipped but soldered on, another pain . Guess I may just have to live with new binding posts and the switch out.
Regards
Ken
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Vansloneker on Tue May 26, 2015 7:56 pm

Most important is that you enjoy the improvements you made!
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Odysseyss on Tue May 26, 2015 8:24 pm

I could dig that. Playing around with speaker cables now, what do you use?
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Ken
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Vansloneker on Wed May 27, 2015 5:32 pm

I am using Prefer LC-425 speaker cable that came with a pair of Apogees I once bought.
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Odysseyss on Wed May 27, 2015 6:49 pm

Thanks Van, never heard of it will google it. May try some Supra one day, heard its good for the price.
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Ken
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby christoph on Thu May 28, 2015 7:56 pm

Hi guys

My heartfelt recommendation regarding speaker cables:

Goertz Foil Cables

They really make a very good combination with apogees.

But be careful: once you heard Goertz Foil Cables, you never want to go back to a lesser cable, the difference is that huge :mrgreen:

Cheers,
Christoph
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Vansloneker on Thu Jan 12, 2017 12:17 pm

A little update. Something has been nagging me for quite a while and by digging into this topic I found out. I had both a Mundorf 0.1uF and an Ampohm 0.1uF bypassing the ribbon connecting cap, and I've come to the conclusion this might have been a little over the top.
Reading back, I had a great experience when I first tested the first pair of Ampohms on the high filter. I had the ribbon connecting cap bypassed by the Mundorf at that time.
I wanted to retry that and first disconnected the Ampohms from the ribbon connecting cap, later wired them to connect to the high filter. The soldering may not have looked great, but boy were those connections hard to de-solder. It took me up to 30 minutes for each connection.

The gain is in the placement of the music. Also little details are more exposed. Like on Vangelis' "I find my way home" there are these little metallic sounds all through the song which got a bit of a three-dimensional scale to them. They were always there, I could always follow them through the song, but they are more free in the air now.
Or on Cindy Lauper's "Girls just want to have fun" the girly squeaky noises, they are positioned from left to to right vice versa, as if little bricks.

Writing it down it sounds like a big difference but it isn't. There's a weird thing to first hearing changes in the sound as they are experienced as huge. Then reverting the situation, going back and forth, the changes really are not that big, just in the details. But then we know how much the details matter for sound reproduction. I am just trying to say the difference is not between no good and good. But good and different good.

I didn't go as far as also removing the smaller Mundorf from the high filter though because of the difficulties of de-soldering it.
I did apply a Vishay cap to the ribbon connecting caps, that suits the Mundorf well. I tried Vishay's on the high filter but still not liked them in that position.
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby EldRick on Sat Jan 14, 2017 11:32 pm

Van - to answer your earlier question, on my Slant 8's, I found more improvement from epoxying the coils than from the bypass and upgrade caps.
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby henk on Thu Jan 19, 2017 3:50 pm

You should not use anything conductive inside or near the coil. Even a stainless steel bolt will lower the inductance of the coil. The varying electric field in the coil will cause eddy currents in any conductor nearby, even when it is not magnetic.

By the same reasoning, using epoxy inside the coil is no problem. It has virtually the same magnetic permeability as air or vacuum. And because it is not conductive, no eddy currents will flow either.

I've solve the co`il-fixing problem in a very simple way: Instead of using a mould to pour the epoxy in, I use a cardboard tube (like the one you get from Graz that contains the bass ribbons...)

First, you cut it to length and glue it down in the place where you want your coil to go. After you've checked that the glue makes a watertight seal, just add the coil and epoxy:) No need to glue the coil afterward, the epoxy does this in one go.

One last thing: I prefer to use polyurethane resin instead of epoxy. It has a much lower surface tension, and will truly fill any voids in the coil. I once lost half of the resin I used because of a 1 mm hole in the glue I used to glue down the tube, it just would not stop leaking trhough this small hole.....
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Re: New Centaur Minor owner

Postby Vansloneker on Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:02 pm

I have reverted the changes. It was great hear lots of music where new details were highlighted. But, some of my most appreciated recordings had lost their magic. Not that there was anything wrong one could point to. But the magic was gone. So I wired the caps back and concluded the magic returned. Then reverted the changes.

I am really hooked to the incredible details the single Mundorfs will reveal. But even more to the magic of the AmpOhms. Had I found the AmpOhms first, I never would have had a second thought. It's not that the detail is gone, it's just slightly less crazy. But the music is more magic.
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